I miss the days when Logitech made great, comfortable mice for normal desktop use, with a small number of useful extra controls and a minimal driver and UI to choose what they did. I miss the days when you could buy a comfortable typist's keyboard for a sensible amount of money.

I literally don't know a single brand that reliably makes good keyboards and mice for normal use any more. Every single one (and I've tried most of the big names) produces junk. Even in the £100+ range that is supposed to be high-end hardware, I have probably returned more than half of the products I've bought in the past few years because they had obvious serious defects out of the box or developed them within a few months of normal use.

I'm hard on that stuff; i killed multiple original 90's manufactured Model M's and wore out a stack of MS trackballs over those 2 decades. One of the fancy logitech "G" blinky lights keyboards lasted less than 3mo under my hands. Kensington cheap trackballs quit moving right in days and stop working in months.

...how? I'm fairly sure I could bludgeon a man to death with my model M and run it over with a truck and it would still work.

Other than that I have one of the cheaper models of Das Keyboard for work and have been nothing but happy with it. Also upgraded it with some o-rings so people around me don't want to kill me.

I use both without installing any junk.

You're talking to one of them. Disappointing failures of both mouse and keyboard resulting in returning hundreds of pounds worth of supposedly high-end products within months of purchase. At least one of the problems I had was also getting reported by others by the time I sent that product back, so it also looks like a design flaw and not just bad luck. I think you also need to install their resource-hungry, crash-prone software to make use of most of the special features too, though that's hardly relevant if keys are falling off and buttons aren't registering presses anyway.

I wouldn't even consider buying more peripherals from Corsair for a while. The quality isn't there and they don't work properly in a you-had-one-job kind of way. Worst of a bad bunch in my experience.

I've been using a $25 Logitech M535 (Bluetooth) for years now with my Mac. Works perfectly, no drivers needed. Not too big, not too small, not too heavy, not too light.

Curious what you don't like about it?

For me, something like the Logitech Performance MX was the peak in terms of mouse comfort, allowing a natural palm grip. It had a couple of useful extra buttons by the thumb, and a few other controls I never used that weren't intrusive. I swore by those things for years and had them on every PC I used regularly.

More recent Logitech models have added a second wheel by the thumb for horizontal scrolling, which I do like. Sadly they also come with a long list of regressions. They try to be too clever with the main scroll wheel. They've added other controls that are easy to trigger unintentionally. Most importantly, the sensors really seem to struggle with some common surface types, something that was never an issue for me with the earlier models.

Somehow the shape for the later models has never quite matched the Performance MX generation either. For me they are mostly either too small for a comfortable palm grip or using some strange spiral effect that makes the middle part too high for comfort in prolonged use. I wonder if the spiral ones are meant to fit the claw grip popular with serious gamers. And the models like the MX Master that were supposed to be an improved Performance MX style somehow never quite fit either, though I struggle to put my finger on why that was.

I still use Logitech mice for most things, because they seem to be the best of a bad bunch for me at the moment. But I'd throw them all out in an instant if I could have the one I actually liked back again.